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Thread: Primers are Primers, Right?

  1. #1
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    Primers are Primers, Right?

    Think again!

    . . or even better; check these two web pages out.

    http://riflemansjournal.blogspot.com...mer-study.html

    http://riflemansjournal.blogspot.com...mer-study.html


    You are welcome.
    I'd rather be lucky than good, but I'd rather KNOW I'm good than HOPE to get lucky.

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    Don't forget the cup thickness diffrence in small rifle between standard and magnum as well as the brisance.

    https://forum.capitalcitygunforum.co...etween-primers

    So what is a soft primer in the above article?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mapper View Post
    Don't forget the cup thickness diffrence in small rifle between standard and magnum as well as the brisance.

    https://forum.capitalcitygunforum.co...etween-primers

    So what is a soft primer in the above article?
    I honestly don't know. A number of them listed I have never even heard of before.. I get from general reading on the web that, "military" primers made by CCI are the hardest and based on my personal observation this seems to be true. As I understand; CCI commercial is next, followed by Wolf. In a pinch, I have loaded for the Ar and the M1A using standard Winchester primers large and small. While I have never experienced a slam fire with them, the the dent left in the primer after firing the preceding round is noticeably more significant that any of the primers I mentioned above.
    I'd rather be lucky than good, but I'd rather KNOW I'm good than HOPE to get lucky.

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    I've always heard Winchesters were middle-of-the-road for hardness and Federal were the softest. A lot of "old timers" would talk about lowering the mainspring on their competition guns so they "would only set off Federal primers."

    I'm sure there's a bunch of information out there on the topic, but I will leave that for others to report back on!

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    Highpower shooters using the AR platform are using Rem 7-1/2 and CCi and Wolf magnums. Federals tend to pierce with hot loads. The M1A shooters are using Win LR, CCI Mil, and Fed 210M. The Longrange bolt gun shooters are using Wolf and Fed 210M in that order. The Wolf seem to get a smaller deviation shot to shot.
    The older WinSR (silver) are harder than the newer (brass colored) ones. If you aren't shooting hot loads even the Fed205M primers are OK.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mapper View Post
    I have learned some things.
    THE GREATER PART OF LIBERTY IS MINDING YOUR OWN FUCKIN BUSINESS.

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    i thought the part about the delayed ignition at starting loads as well as using pistol primers for 22 hornet was interesting in that article.

    this is some pressure trace data from another forum i frequent, it is a bit long, but interesting.
    Quote Originally Posted by jwtharpe
    Here is some primer data for you guys to look at.
    Quote Originally Posted by jwtharpe

    I have been struggling with flyers from more than one rifle and I'm trying to find the cause.
    90% of the time I load with 450 primers for all of my small case cartridges. I have a few different loads that don't use 450's for whatever reason.

    The data was collected from the 20" McGowan 6mm Mongoose barrel. I used a different powder and target velocity to insure that the Fiocchi and 6-1/2 primers wouldn't pierce. They are softer than the rest that I tested.
    TAC has also been unusually inaccurate from this barrel, so I might as well look at it as well.
    I only have 5 different small rifle primers on hand. I will be getting some more varieties to add to the test results from today.


    Load data
    Case- TA-10 neck turned flash holes de-burred
    Primer- varoius
    Bullet- 55gr. Nosler shots
    Trim- 1.690"
    Powder- TAC
    Powder Charge- 29.0gr.
    Barrel- 20" 4groove 8T McGowan AR
    COL- 2.100" 1.805"
    Temp- 80*

    First is the target. It looks like the Remington 6-1/2 is giving the best group with the others looking mostly the same at around MOA. the grids are .9"




    I think the dip in the graph before the barrel exit is the cause of some of my accuracy issues. This is a characteristic of TAC powder with the 20" Mongoose barrel. A different length barrel might like it better than this one. The delayed ignition on some of the primers is not helping either.

    Here are the traces.


    The Rem 6-1/2's don't look too bad compared to some of the others. At this pressure level they are safe. I wouldn't want to go up much more with them. They had some light cratering.


    These 450's are dog doo-doo just the same as the BR-4's. Delayed ignition on some shots.


    The BR-4's that I have are dog doo-doo for the Mongoose. Look at the delayed ignition at the front of the chart. These same batch of primers are what I use for my 6.8SPC long range loads. That rifle shoots sub .5 MOA with es in the single digits with these same primers.



    The Fiocchi is the best looking of all of them. Velocity was higher, ES in the teens SD in the single digits. I'm going to be hunting for some more of these. Too bad they cant stand much pressure. Will have to limit them to less than 60KPSI to prevent piercing. I can live with that...



    This the WSR chart. I only got 3 shots recorded because I forgot to turn stuff on.
    Looks like dog doo-doo anyways...


    Last edited by mapper; May 8th, 2016 at 09:30 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mapper View Post
    i thought the part about the delayed ignition at starting loads as well as using pistol primers for 22 hornet was interesting in that article.

    this is some pressure trace data from another forum i frequent, it is a bit long, but interesting.
    As did I. I wonder if those cases and the one in the graph left unburnt powder in the chamber.... Remember that .204 I was telling you about?

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