Lyman is by far the best for a new reloader . They go more in to depth about the mechanics of reloading than any of the others.
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Lyman is by far the best for a new reloader . They go more in to depth about the mechanics of reloading than any of the others.
The 50th Edition Lyman just came out this year. It is by far better than the Hornady 10th Ed. However, a Hornady 8th, 9th or 10th would be a good second book. I have some articles from old Guns and Ammo issues for the 220 Swift by Sitton, 300 Weatherby and .30-30 Win by Bob Forker that I have for those rounds. I back stopped them with the Lyman and Hornady manuals before I went to work.Quote:
Originally Posted by FLT
Been working on the reloading table and I'm 99% done. I want to add shelves next to the pegboard to put the powder, bullets and dies. Should be able to finish this week. Attachment 10169 Attachment 10170 Attachment 10171Attachment 10172 Attachment 10173 Attachment 10174 Attachment 10175Attachment 10176 Attachment 10177Attachment 10178
Be sure and weight the dog crap out of it.
The heavier the better.
Will do. That's why I reinforce the lower shelf, I'm putting some heavy stuff down there, so I can crank that handle with authority :DQuote:
Originally Posted by SB
Those pre-fab legs on that table are trick.
Is was worried about how sturdy they were, but so far so good. I been moving the table around to finished and the legs are rock solid. But if they fail, I have lots of pallets in my yard that I can use to put legs on the table. I just had those sitting around and decided to used.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tack Driver
This sucks. I already deprimed all my brass, order a tumbler and they send me a 230 volts international model. Never seen that electric plug before. The bench is done, just need to clean the brass and start playing with loads. The wife told me to stop spending money, I told her....Is all Mappers fault. Attachment 10271Attachment 10272Attachment 10273Attachment 10274Attachment 10275
That's a Euro standard plug. Just order a simple converter plug or cord. No biggie
so she isn't quite on board with the
"I'm saving money by reloading"
Or the "I'm recycling and doing my part for the environment"
Or the "but dear, I haven't been to a gun shop/show looking at rifles, just seeing what they had as far as reloading supplies"
Or the "it adds another dimension to shooting, being able to tune the ammo to the gun"
If she shoots pistol, say 38 or 9,
Load enough up for a all she can shoot range trip, take some 22 lr, as well.
As a passing comment mention the cost is the same for all 3, but 22 is harder to find than just going to the press.
Just try'in to be helpful. :poke:
So your're saying that works at your house or that's just the BS you've tried to sling so far :dunno:
No Outlaw, I think it more of a "misery loves company" thing on Mapper's part.
Yes.
That worked a BS toss. (Just make sure she runs out of 22 first)
As far as the BS slinging
That came from the missus saying, "it seems like you are spending a lot of time on that reloading thing, and I'm not seeing you as much.
So....
"Ya know babe, if I got that electric trimmer, or chargemaster, or case prep center, or dillon press, or xxxx thing, that would free up a lot of time I spend out there. You know you told me all these years to work smarter, not harder. Rifle is more involved than pistol,so it is taking longer"
That one is still working somewhat. :goodjob:
It still requires "all she can shoot at range day amounts" to be semi-believable.
Good shit mapper. She had come down a lot since I got her this, now she don't bother me much https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00UM46WQU/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 .
I just send it back today. They paid for the return. I order a different one from amazon. More money, but the reviews are all 5 starts and it come with the media and cleaner. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1Quote:
Originally Posted by Evil_McNasty
Now she can understand the work smarter not harder philosophy first hand.. :goodjob:
I just tell mine to make me a sandwich, on Jewish rye, I have shit to do. That will usually buy me another 1/2 hour of no interruptions.
It's called "The silent treatment," and they think it's punishment.
:hahaha:Quote:
Originally Posted by SB
I wish I could find that nervous rambling you posted a year or so ago when you forgot y'alls anniversary. It had a little different tone than the above quoted post.Quote:
Originally Posted by 12bhunting
A man must know his limitations.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cattle/Horses
I put it to my wife this way....... Your car payment, $360 a month, $4320 a year, Mine $0, Your nails, $20 a month $240 a year, Mine $0, your hair cuts, $75 every 2 months $450 a year, Mine $0, I cut my own hair, Make up, average of $20 a month(we all know is a lot more than that) $240, Mine, $0., there is no make up in this world, that would make me look pretty. So $0. Your lunches, Average $5 a day for 48 weeks(leaving vacation time out) $1200, Mine $0, I pack my own lunch. Her total every year.....$6,450...Mine $0, and I told her, " and this is with out counting underwear and bras, Cus I don't use bras, and I don't wear underwear" followed with " you work 2080 hours a year, I work 2860 hours a year", I finish with "Baby, I'm just trying to keep up with you, and I can't" And you know how it goes, the roll of the eyes, the confused look, and the angry face.... followed with "But you still spend to much money" LOL. She don't complain any more
I just tell the SHTW if I can't enjoy the fruits of my labor I'm stayin home...She's usually much more reasonable after that.
I actually sold 2 presses I had, shocking as that sounds.
That frees up some room on the bench for the stuff that took its place.:banana:
Finally got the Wet Tumbler and wet/dry media separator. I love the result of the wet tumbler, with just 3 hours of tumbling(was told, that I only need a 90 min tumble, or 2 hours tumble, if brass is really dirty). Also love the idea, of the media lasting forever( if I don't loosed). Primer pockets are clean also. After reading about the drying complain, I will be working on a drying station, made out from a 5 gallon paint bucket and lid, spaghetti strainer and an old hair blower. I used a car drying chamois and the blower and the brass dried really quick. Attachment 10333Attachment 10334Attachment 10335Attachment 10336
Cheap drying station for wet tumbling brass Attachment 10363Attachment 10364Attachment 10365Attachment 10366Attachment 10367Attachment 10368
I dry my brass in the oven usually. Set it on 170, put the brass on a pizza tray and let it relax.
My first reloads of 308 win. Now I need the range to open for 100 yards to test. Attachment 10676
Just for whatever it's worth... I'm pretty much appalled that the term "manual" didn't come up (so far as I saw) till Post # 48, and 30plusretlaw had to bring it up himself. I ain't been 'round lately, or that wouldn't have happened. In his case, his plans seem fairly simple and to the point, and yet I just really don't feel comfortable about "helping" anyone learn to hand load with out telling them that "THE FIRST THING YOU DO IS GET A MANUAL. THE SECOND THING YOU DO IS READ THE MANUAL... NOT JUST THE PART ABOUT THE PARTICULAR CARTRIDGE YOU WANT TO LOAD... BUT ALSO THE GENERAL EXPLANATION PART. THEN YOU READ THE GENERAL EXPLANATION PART AGAIN (AND AGAIN, UNTIL YOU ARE PRETTY SURE YOU UNDERSTAND IT). THEN YOU CAN START WORKING OUT A SPECIFIC LOAD FOR A SPECIFIC CARTRIDGE, SPECIFIC BULLET, AND SPECIFIC POWDER.
Several of you mentioned the Lyman Manual, but actually there are TWO GENERAL metallic cartridge smokeless powder manuals (Lyman's Reloading Handbook 50th Edition and Richard Lee's updated second printing of his Modern Reloading Second Edition) that I know of, that have good general introductory sections, and especially for REDUCED LOADS of rifle cartridges using cast lead bullets. Lee skins that cat a whole different way. Actually Lyman has several manuals, a Cast Bullet Handbook now on its 4th edition, a Black Powder Handbook and Loading Manual, 2d Edition, a Shotshell Reloading Handbook 5th Edition, and an AR Reloading Handbook, that I know of. If one happens to be into shotshell reloading Ballistic Products has a large manual that I have a copy of but have not read, plus some smaller, specialized, manuals. The general precautionary note is that those tested loads, published in a proofread book with a big company's name behind it... those are safe to use if you understand them. Loads posted on the internet by Joe Dyslexic, perhaps after two six-packs and a 50 tokes on a bong... not so much. And making your own "mathematical adjustments" on a load... Un Unh. It don't work that way... Don't do that!
If you want to stick to products of one company, several companies have manuals that reference only their own products and especially for powders there is also some online load data from the powder company. But Lyman and Lee in general list multiple companies' products. When you get to the point of trying to load something different without having to buy another powder, though, it helps to have Lyman, Lee, and possibly others. But, in general, the more guns you load for, the more powders you are likely to end up "needing", and only a few of them work in both hand guns and rifles, or shotguns.
Since I load smokeless and/or black powder cartridges for almost everything under the sun, I've come to appreciate how versatile black powder is, although most of the rules for smokeless and black powder are very different and there is considerable danger if you don't know that.
And for "we few, we happy few" who actually got this far, this isn't so much for 30plusretlaw as for whatever silent souls who may just be lurking out there, and absorbing things. It's nice if they can absorb sort of right-ish things, every once and awhile.
<--- Short attention span.
There you go being a dick again. You are appalled at every post in the thread. And you feel it's necessary for you to let lurkers know the right-ish things every once in while.....
I honestly do enjoy your most of your post. But why you feel it's necessary to be a rude arrogant fucking prick is beyond me. While your post are very informative, you always add some condescending bullshit. While I have no fucks to give about what you need to do to make yourself feel better, I wouldn't feel right not sharing with you my opinion. I am not attacking you. I am not angry with you and hold no hard feelings. I do not want you to quit posting. But if you are going to throw little arrogant jabs into your post, expect to be called on it.
There are 2 areas for posts in the reloading section.
Since this IS rumblers house, everyone knows how hard stuff is to find.
The info is there, but just not organized in one thread or post.
So one wanting to reload should take the time to read the posts in both sections.
here is one of them that states the need for a manual early.
https://forum.capitalcitygunforum.co...o-to-reloading
https://forum.capitalcitygunforum.co...bout-reloading
https://forum.capitalcitygunforum.co...ment-questions
https://forum.capitalcitygunforum.co...ding-questions
Everyone has their favorites as far as equipment brands, and info in this *may* be dated a little, but content is worthwhile to read.
https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=230171
As far as how to, or what each step of the reload process is,
The abc's of reloading is good.
It does not push one manufacturer over another or have any load data in it.
Modern reloading by richard lee goes over the process as well, but as you would expect features lee products.
The load data in the back is compiled from many sources, and should be cross checked against other sources, a a good practice for any load, from any place.
The lyman book (at least in the 49th or 50 the or whatever I have) has a good explanation of the process, it has load data as well, and is very beneficial when working with cast lead loadings.
The sierra book mainly uses their bullets, no pressure testing that I am aware of, and a good selection of powders used. They list what the test weapon, brass, primer, powder was used.
Hornady mainly uses their bullets.
As far as loads from powder manufacturers, those are pressure tested, at least the data I saw from hodgdon,Imr.
I guess, it would be better presented in steps Like basic concepts of the process
Minimum basic equipment
Diffrences in equipment choices
Intended uses
Load development
But re read the 2nt sentence in this post, again.
30+, let us know how your load development went, when you get out to the range.
Just to let everyone know, I have 2 manuals. I have the Nosler reloading guide, that came with my kit. Many here suggested to get more than one, and compare the loads on the manuals, before reloading, so I bought the Lyman 50th edition. Another thing that help me A LOT, was private messaging Mapper, and I really appreciate all the help and knowledge he had giving me. I also did my first reloading VERY slow, step by step, double checking everything and I know, I could had done better, but it was my first time. Today, I was able to go test, what I reloaded. Let start by saying, I'm no season shooter. I'm learning the craft of shooting at the same time, I learn to reload. So flyers are abundant. That's is why, instead of 3 rounds per weight, I loaded 5 rounds for every weight. The bullet: Hornady Match 168gr BTHP, Primer: Winchester WLR primers, case: Federal once shot cases, NOT fired form and Varget powder. 100 yards, 2 inch targets. This were the results today. Attachment 10788 There is one missing round on the factory load of Federal premium 168 grain GMM . I forgot to dial the scope down from 300y to 100y, and the round was nowhere to be found. Attachment 10789 I started with 42 g, since it was the lowest load on both manuals for Varget with 168 bullet. I increased to load by .5 every time. Attachment 10790 two flyers here. Attachment 10791 I don't think the 2 outside of the target were flyers because the groups started shrinking. Attachment 10792 I think 43.5g, is bad shooting from my part. 44g Attachment 10793 , 44.5 Attachment 10794 group getting better. 45g Attachment 10795 I like the 45g group. 45.5 Attachment 10796 group, started oppening again. 46g Attachment 10797 still a good group, but I didn't want to go any higher. I know the groups would be better, if I was a better shooter. I liked the grains between 44.5g to 45.5g . I think the 45g group was the best since all 5 rounds were close. The 42g and 42.5 groups, with out the flyers are great also. What do you guys think?
I think you have it figured out.
The 45 looks best to me. However measure them to be sure.
While vertical dispersion looks good at 45 gr, how did the primers look?
were they flat, or still had a little radius left?
Did they show any signs of cratering where the firing pin struck?
If no ejection issues, or signs of pressure, you could either run with it,
Or you could try and dropping the charge weight about 0.2 gr from 45 gr, as well as increasing it to 45.2 gr.
It may get a little better, or not.
The idea here is to have a little leeway in charge weight from your desired charge.
For temperature and powder lot variations.
Then you may or may not decide to experiment with seating depths and see if that makes a diffrence.
The seating depths if you are using them in a magazine will be the limiting point if you don't want to single feed.
At some point you will get to the "that's good enough for me" point.
You may be there already, but the process is sound that you have gone through.
The rifle will tell you what it likes.
A load that looks good at 100 may be diffrent at 300,
But it is a good place to start.
Thanks for posting your results. :goodjob:
Looks good.
It is a bit of work, but satisfying when you find a load the rifle really likes.
Mapper, to tell you the truth, I saw no difference between the 42.5g primers and the 46g primers or brass. Once I pass the 43.5g, since I was scare shitless, I was inspecting every case. I think been scared, was the reason, I had so many flyers at the low grain bullets. After the first few, I was more confident. I had no ejection issues either. Maybe was because on this testing rounds, I ran the brass on a sami specs, full length die. I have not touch my fire formed brass yet.
I was thinking, I might do another test, but this time, do .1g increments starting at 44.6g, since I already have a 44.5g results, all the way to 45.4g. My problem is, that I don't have a range that is open everyday with 100y close to home. I love going to the police range, The Policeman running the range, are always funny and fun to talk too. I do have a public range closer, but my experience there, was not a good one. Talking to others, their experiences been the same as mine. I might have to bite the bullet and go there.
On the size of the bullets, I measure my lands at 2.89. The inside of my Accurate mag, measured at 2.98, so I think I'm good there. I will double check, once I start using my fired form cases. I plant to remeasure everything again. I also notice that at the low grains, the group were close, but impacted lower, than I was aiming. the 44.5g to the 45g, were impacting at the aiming level. 46g did the same and higher. So I will stay around the 45g +- loads. Thanks again for all the help and opinions you guys gave me.
Attachment 10811Attachment 10812Attachment 10813Attachment 10814
Primers look good on 46 gr,
I don't think that 0.1 gr powder steps will tell you anything measurable, other than using components.
That's why I suggested a step halfway between what you had.
The node should be bigger than 0.2 gr.
Remember 0.2/46 = 0.4% of case capacity.
If you wanted to see, sure you could do it.
But that's 30 more loaded rounds than a ladder at 44.8 and 45.2
The inside of lands measurement should be from base of case to ogive on bullet where it hits lands.
The magazine dimension is overall length, which is diffrent.
I get these dimensions from a hornady bullet comparator, a hornady oal guage and a modified case, and a caliper.
If you don't have one I'll lend you mine.
Pm me if you need it.
Magazine fed rifles will be limited to the length of the mag, metal mags generally are thinner construction than plastic and give a little more length.
Thanks for the offer. I already bought all that, using your links in another thread. That's why I mention, I was going to remeasure everything, because I think I measure the bullet length incorrectly. I will go .2g at a time. This is fun and entertaining. I was surprised the primers were all good and no signs of pressure on the brass either. So I will stay on the safe side. The longest I can shoot is 300y, so no need to try to push the envelope. My goal is to find a load that is good from 100y to maybe 600 y and stay on the safe zone. I also have 2 more bullets to test also. I have sierra HPBT match bullets and Hornandy Amax black (plastic tip). Since my distance is so close, I'll stay with 168 grs. We were talking yesterday about going to Malabars 600 yards range. If we do, Ill buy some 175 grs.Quote:
Originally Posted by mapper
For simplicity's sake, I would load up 20-30 of those 45'ers and stretch it out to 200-300yds next when possible.
Many of those loads look good. You are cleary doing a maticulous job there.
..Quote:
Originally Posted by mapper
Worth repeating.
This is part of my plan. I'm taking my fireform casings and test the 3 types of bullets I have, at 300 yards. Is hard to test at different distances because, the same police range, is used for all distances, just on different days. I will sit and think what I want to do and where I want to go with this. I have another caliber, I need to do the same thing. I have an RPR, 6.5 creed, I haven't shoot yet. Thanks again for all the advice. I really appreciated.Quote:
Originally Posted by Evil_McNasty
The range was open this weekend, so I test some other loads around the first loads I liked 45g and 42.5 g of varget, I did 9 more loads of 5 bullets each. There's one load, that I'm baffle with, the 44.3 load, have 3 shoots going in one hole...... or so I think. The target only show 3 holes but one hole is bigger than the other 2, telling me, that there's the possibility that more than one bullet pass trough that hole. No...I didn't shoot someone else target. The closes target to mine , was around 20 feet away, and my target was the only black target out there, so I can see the bulls-eyes better. I check the other targets on my board and none have more than 5 holes in it. I did notice, that the loads around my initial 2 numbers are good. I was able to hit good groups and since this was my second rodeo, I was not afraid of the rifle blowing up. Attachment 11143 Attachment 11144 Attachment 11145 Attachment 11146 Attachment 11147 Attachment 11148 Attachment 11149 Attachment 11150 Attachment 11151
I like the 42.7. No need to go hotter than you need. Stretch them out at 300 and see what you get.
I'd play more with 45gr. Varget. Running a weaker load is like only using half your Dick while fucking.
My best loads for my 308 is 42.5 & 45.5 using varget under a 165 gr game king. I found it to be a common occurrence looking at other guys data and it saved me a lot of time. Maybe not as fun as running various ladders....
Load development for target is diffrent for load development for hunting.
A lot is similar, but the nuances that are not is that target shooters are not concerned with terminal ballistics and muzzle energy.
Paper is real easy to kill.
Bullets behave diffrently at 300 or longer than they do at short range.
Now if you were looking for a long range load that would stay supersonic, that is diffrent than a midrange load.
Scopes have elevation dials on them for a reason.
He is a lot closer to malabar gun club than we are, just sayin.
The rifle will tell you what it likes.
Just talking shit man. The 42.5 is my kid load. Will work just as well on paper as it will deer....Quote:
Originally Posted by mapper
I do like the 42.4, 42.5 and 42.7 , I will stick to those grains of powder for my 100-300 y shooting. The 45 gr, will be for 600+ yards, when I can go to a range that have that distance. When I get the chance, I will definitely try them at 300 y. Now I can concentrate on the 6.5 creed.Quote:
Originally Posted by mapper