Boolit Casting, à new experience begins

[mapper]

I ran across this in my travels, and I'm reading it currently, then I'll start on the lyman cast bullet book.
I have some molds, others are inbound.
A bottom pour pot and a ladle pot.
So I'll have to clean up the old pot and some molds, I was planning on using evapo-rust for the steel molds and ferrous stuff.

I'm sure I'll have questions as I go about this adventure, as it is new to me.
http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Contents.htm

[mapper]

Lots of info and thoughts on boolit lube, as far as hardness and flow characteristics, I *may* have to rethink that hard boolit lube thing again. I've got more reading to do.
Yes I have a heater in a lubrisizer. Molds have lube grooves, not tumble lube.

Orange magic may be a bit hard for my use as I'm not pushing things that hot to require it.

Someone told me they used a mix of locomotive siderod grease mixed with beeswax back in the 1960's that they ran through star lubrisizers without heaters.


https://castbulletassoc.org/uploads/newpdf/cblube2016.pdf

[12bhunting]

Definitely interested....

[leadpoison]

following

[Mad Man]

Have you looked into the Hi Tek bullet coating instead of traditional bullet lube? In my experience with Commerical cast bullets it is way better. If I start casting this is what I’ll use.

[mapper]

I have some coated boolits, some cast boolits with the hard parrafin/carnuba type wax,
But haven't really loaded many of the coated ones.
I remember a conversation I had with someone about coated boolits and he was pushing them fairly hard, and said that powder coated could go to 2200 fps or so, I'll have to verify and check that.

But the thing is it was more than I thought,.
Now on just reading the first link I posted, and only getting to the lube section, is as far as I've got.
But that took it past bullet hardness.

So I'm just going off 1 source so far about bullet hardness, obturation, and lubrication in regard to sealing against bore, and lube as it goes down rifling.

That kind of brings up the issue of powder coating as a gilding material, or jacket like a copper plating, or as a lubricity agent.

Lubes work when they melt and flow. They help to seal the bore as well.
Alox and beeswax have been used for decades, as well as other things.

Light target loads <900 fps behave diffrent than loads >1100 fps
so I'm not expecting a lot of differences in 45 and 38, but would see more in 9 mm as it's pushed faster.
Same for magnum pistol calibers.

So I'm in research and learning mode currently.
I haven't scoured the forums at castboolits dot Com, but I know it is a resource that I will use.
I'm trying to get a good overview at this point.

Now as far as way better between cast and lubed boolits and powder coated ones, can you explain a bit on that,? I'd like to hear what you've experienced.

[BWest]

I powder coat everything I cast. The powder coat doesn't totally eliminate the need for a gas check for really fast loads, but you can push bullets much faster with no leading than you could with just traditional lube. Plus there is considerably less smoke and lube fouling. I consider powder coating to be superior for 90% of cast bullet applications.

Also, I don't know if I mentioned previously, but the coating has its own hardness separate from the lead underneath. You can read some forums about this, but in my 1000s of cast bullets I've never done more than eyeball estimate my alloy, then once I powder coat the bullets I quench them in water. I've never dealt with lead fouling, at least not so much that a couple run-throughs of the bore snake can't take care of.

[mapper]

Are you casting, then powder coating, then sizing, then heat treating, and quenching after that? Or quenching after casting, then powder coating then sizing?

Yes I can believe that would make for a hard boolit,
What kind of velocities are you pushing,, and at what point does the need for a gas check come into play?

This opens up things beyond standard pistol subsonic uses.

[BWest]

Also, there is a difference between "powder coat" and "hitek" coatings, Powder Coat is (in my view) all encompassing, including the powder coat paints used in automotive and other manufacturing. Hitek is basically the same end result (a bit thinner and smoother result I think), but is a commercial product designed specifically for bullets (could be wrong here), and goes on wet instead of dry like normal powder coat paint.

My powder coating method:

Powder coat I use:
I have been successful with Harbor Freight Red powder coat. I don't know why, but it is known to be the best of the Harbor Freight colors for coating bullets. I would not recommend starting with this however, I would suggest any of the powder coats made by Eastwood. I use their "light ford blue" and it it covers well. https://www.eastwood.com/hotcoat-powder-ford-light-blue.html (https://www.eastwood.com/hotcoat-powder-ford-light-blue.html?SRCCODE=PLA00010&gclid=Cj0KCQiAlZH_BRCgARIsAAZHSBmG5jK3qaQ1r9vWKl8-j9Gpc9Fbr-lqwyGqrEFS0QhQ3hxUljP97LEaAtzpEALw_wcB)

I think Powder by the Pound and Smoke's are also brands people use for this.

Procedure:

after casting the bullets, I shake them around in a yogurt or similar plastic container with a little bit of the powder. Plastic containers have static electricity that causes the powder to stick to the bullets. Containers with the Recycling symbol 5 seem to be the best for this. These are the soft white plastic tubs like for yogurt, cool whip, cookie dough, feta cheese and stuff like that.

Once they are covered, I dump them on a piece of mesh to get the excess powder off, then either bake them on the mesh, or on a piece of baking parchment paper. Some people stand them up using forceps or gloved fingers, but I think the slightly prettier bullets that come out are not work the hassle of standing them all up. you can always coat them again if there are some bald spots from bullets sticking together or to the mesh.

I bake them in a old electric toaster oven I got for 5 dollars from the salvation army. The "rule" is 20 minutes at 400 degrees, but I've played around with lower temps for longer and gotten good results.

After they are done, I quench them in water. To test the adhesion, you can smash a coated bullet with a hammer, the coating should not come off and should flex with the smashed bullet.

Then just load as normal.

[BWest]

Here is some of my .30 Carbine coated in Eastwood Ford blue:

17660

[mapper]

Thanks for posting that. Those look great. :goodjob:

[BWest]

the steps are

cast, coat, quench, dry, size, load, unload

[Mad Man]

Those do look good and it’s probably cheaper than the hi tek coating.

[BWest]

Also, I mentioned it in the other thread, but Fortunecooki45LC and Elvis Ammo are two great youtube channels with lots about casting and coating

[BWest]

Those do look good and it’s probably cheaper than the hi tek coating.

yeah I think it is. I don't know exactly how hi-tek works, but I think it's a little more of a pain to do, since it is applied as a liquid and whatnot.

[BWest]

I've cast, coated and loaded for,

.38/.357, .32 acp, 7.62x25 tokarev, .30 carbine, 8mm mauser, .223 rem

Got the molds and sizers to do any .30 cal rifle now too, and 9mm, but haven't tried it yet. I have shot lots of commercial coated 9mm bullets before though.

[BWest]

One of my new years goals is to do 7.7 Jap, 7.62x39, and get some cast bullets to cycle in my Garand.

[Mad Man]

yeah I think it is. I don't know exactly how hi-tek works, but I think it's a little more of a pain to do, since it is applied as a liquid and whatnot.

I’ve never done it before but from the videos I’ve seen it doesn’t look hard. Mix the coating and accelerant together then shake the bullets around in a plastic container with the coating and bake. This is the only coating I’ve used because I get my cast bullets from bayou bullets. I want to try powder coat now and see how it compares. I’m sure it’s about the same result.

[Cattle/Horses]

Here is some of my .30 Carbine coated in Eastwood Ford blue:

17660

Before I read anything, just as I saw the pic, I thought, DAMN, a 357 loaded with a Viagra pill - that's a hell of a way to administer it.

[Mad Man]

17662

Here are some bayou bullets with the hi tek coating.

[FLT]

I have a question, does the coating stay on well enough to prevent getting lead in your suppressor/silencer ?

[Mad Man]

On the bullets I’m using I would say no. I haven’t shot any through my suppressor but the flash hider on my 9mm AR had a good amount of lead built up in the holes. I never had barrel leading issues though.

[BWest]

Before I read anything, just as I saw the pic, I thought, DAMN, a 357 loaded with a Viagra pill - that's a hell of a way to administer it.

best not to mix up your hard-on boolits with others should you need to defend yourself from an attacker....

[Cattle/Horses]

best not to mix up your hard-on boolits with others should you need to defend yourself from an attacker....

Could be a new depth to the saying "shooting blanks".

[mapper]

Well, a mold mallet and some lee molds showed up.
I'm still reading..I found a bottom pour pot I didn't know I had..getting a bit closer
17669

17668

[Cattle/Horses]

Mapper, let me be the first to place my order for some 325 to 350 grain 44 magnum bullets. 1000 - 2000 would be good

:)

[mapper]

C/H, I think you have me confused with Donnie Miculek.

They are 12-14 week backlog..

I'm just trying to expand my recycling skills..

[Cattle/Horses]

Just always looking for new sources. Hope springs eternal. lol

[FLT]

Well, a mold mallet and some lee molds showed up.
I'm still reading..I found a bottom pour pot I didn't know I had..getting a bit closer
17669

17668

Mapper, pay close attention to the instructions when they talk about smoking the molds. Those lee molds require a little deferent process than cast iron molds.

[mapper]

Will do, thanks.
I would expect aluminum molds behave a bit different than steel ones, I've seen suggestions to heat them with the sprue plate down, due to different thermal properties of the steel and aluminum. It's all going to be a learning curve. I have some lyman or ideal molds as well..I just wanted a round profile to start with

[BWest]

I own two Lyman molds, and they work great, but I have 8 Lee molds, which I consider to be the best value.

My method of using the Lee molds:

prep:

1.Take a lighter and burn off whatever packing grease or whatever is currently in the mold, you can also use alchohol or brake cleaner but I've just used a lighter on my last couple molds and it's done fine.

2. Smoke the mold, you can use a candle, let the flame touch every surface of the mold and blacken it, both the inside cavity and flat surfaces around the cavity. I typically use a piece of lighter wood, since the flame is bigger and it will blacken the whole mold very fast.

3. oil joints, take some 3 in 1 or whatever (5w30, rem oil...) and oil the joint on the handles. Then open the sprue plate and oil the hinge screw, and move it back and forth a bunch to make sure it is loose enough to move freely. If I can, I'll even take a phillips screwdriver and try and loosen the screw a quarter turn, though the gorillas at Lee tighten them really well so I haven't always been able to. I consider the sprue plate to be the weak part of Lee's design, as the molds heat up they get hard to open, and on one of my molds I've even gouged the top of the mold because the sprue plate was too tight. I also lightly oil the bottom surface of the sprue plate, so it lubricates it moving across the top of the mold surface, I think it helps some.

Use:

Lee molds cast shitty bullets until they heat up, then they cast good ones. Being aluminum, they heat up pretty fast, but also cool fast, so you should cast as fast as you safely can to get repeatable quality pours and drops.

Before using them, I will stage the molds by leaning them against the pot to preheat. I've always leaned them sprue plate facing up, I don't know if the other way would make a difference. Then, once I'm ready to cast I will cast several bullets and drop them directly back into the molten lead (from pretty close to avoid splashing), Lee molds tend to take several castings before they really heat up enough to drop good looking bullets. (that being said, slightly ugly bullets don't matter all that much in my opinion, in most cases)

after filling however many cavities, I will pour a little lead on to the plate, this gives a large enough piece to pull any lead that gets stuck in the holes in the sprue plate free.

I don't use a mold mallet unless I absolutely can't open the sprue by hand. I feel this prolongs the life of the mold (cause you aren't beating on it), and is more time efficient. I just wear thick leather gloves and push the sprue open with the palm of my hand, then if it is hot enough the cutoff excess lead should just fall off, then I just open the mold and shake it to get the bullets to fall out onto a wet towel.

[BWest]

Also I highly suggest getting the Lyman (or maybe other brands have them too) ball dipper with the nipple that mates up directly to the holes in the sprue plate, much easier than a ladle like Lee has.

[BWest]

Also I highly suggest getting the Lyman (or maybe other brands have them too) ball dipper with the nipple that mates up directly to the holes in the sprue plate, much easier than a ladle like Lee has.

I forgot, you have a bottom pour don't you mapper, probably even easier than the ball dipper

[Cattle/Horses]

Mapper, let me be the first to place my order for some 325 to 350 grain 44 magnum bullets. 1000 - 2000 would be good

:)

Any idea of an ETA on these?

[WinterSoldier]

I own two Lyman molds, and they work great, but I have 8 Lee molds, which I consider to be the best value.

My method of using the Lee molds:

prep:

1.Take a lighter and burn off whatever packing grease or whatever is currently in the mold, you can also use alchohol or brake cleaner but I've just used a lighter on my last couple molds and it's done fine.

2. Smoke the mold, you can use a candle, let the flame touch every surface of the mold and blacken it, both the inside cavity and flat surfaces around the cavity. I typically use a piece of lighter wood, since the flame is bigger and it will blacken the whole mold very fast.

3. oil joints, take some 3 in 1 or whatever (5w30, rem oil...) and oil the joint on the handles. Then open the sprue plate and oil the hinge screw, and move it back and forth a bunch to make sure it is loose enough to move freely. If I can, I'll even take a phillips screwdriver and try and loosen the screw a quarter turn, though the gorillas at Lee tighten them really well so I haven't always been able to. I consider the sprue plate to be the weak part of Lee's design, as the molds heat up they get hard to open, and on one of my molds I've even gouged the top of the mold because the sprue plate was too tight. I also lightly oil the bottom surface of the sprue plate, so it lubricates it moving across the top of the mold surface, I think it helps some.

Use:

Lee molds cast shitty bullets until they heat up, then they cast good ones. Being aluminum, they heat up pretty fast, but also cool fast, so you should cast as fast as you safely can to get repeatable quality pours and drops.

Before using them, I will stage the molds by leaning them against the pot to preheat. I've always leaned them sprue plate facing up, I don't know if the other way would make a difference. Then, once I'm ready to cast I will cast several bullets and drop them directly back into the molten lead (from pretty close to avoid splashing), Lee molds tend to take several castings before they really heat up enough to drop good looking bullets. (that being said, slightly ugly bullets don't matter all that much in my opinion, in most cases)

after filling however many cavities, I will pour a little lead on to the plate, this gives a large enough piece to pull any lead that gets stuck in the holes in the sprue plate free.

I don't use a mold mallet unless I absolutely can't open the sprue by hand. I feel this prolongs the life of the mold (cause you aren't beating on it), and is more time efficient. I just wear thick leather gloves and push the sprue open with the palm of my hand, then if it is hot enough the cutoff excess lead should just fall off, then I just open the mold and shake it to get the bullets to fall out onto a wet towel.

Clean your molds with mineral spirits and a small brush, then air dry them. Ballistol will remove minor rust, but I have had to remove major rust by immersion in lemon juice... then Ballistol will neutralize any remnants of acid. Lube the parts that need lubing (e.g. alignment pins) with a tiny touch of beeswax after heating them. Beeswax melts and spreads like crazy though, so you have to do that very lightly and very carefully carefully. Though I have commercial products, I do most fluxing of lead with beeswax, too... and its the main ingredient in black powder bullet lube, along with some amount of some kind of VEGETABLE oil.

I use about a 12 inch or slightly longer section of 3/4 inch dowel to tap sprue plates, or, often just to push them open and closed. I HATE using leather gloves... but sometimes I do, and sometimes I just burn myself. What the Hell?!!!

You can never buy a new one, but the best molds ever made were the George S. Hensley molds, followed by the Hensley & Gibbs molds. They are worth what you pay for them on eBay.

On the other end of the scale, Lee Precision molds will do the job at least for awhile. Lee, NOE, CBE, Mountain Molds, Meha Prevec, and other aluminum molds are my least favorite to use, but at least for awhile they will turn out bullets... and where else can I find a .329 mold that will make a bullet usable in a Kropatschek?

I just use kitchen matches to smoke the mold cavities, being sure to get all parts of the cavities. If your smoking isn't working (bullets are sticking/hard to release from the mold, smoke them again. If that doesn't work... clean them with mineral spirits and a brush, air dry, then smoke them again.

I specialize more in low velocity, older guns, black powder guns using black powder or those that made the conversion to early semi-smokeless or smokeless... and reduced loads in modern guns using soft(ish) lead, so powder coating doesn't even interest me (it sho do look priddy, though)
One point of note about quenching bullets, is that the hardening effect is TEMPORARY. Once I cast them I may not use the bullets for many years, so besides not really looking for high velocity or particularly hard bullets, quenching has never been part of my repertoire, except when annealing brass. If I ever get around to working with 5.56mm cast loads, though, I guess I'll have to move in that direction. At the low velocities I drive them, just ordinary wheel weight or linotype loads have done fine in 7.62x39mm.

And Lee tumble lube works awfully well, is quicker and easier... but lubrisizing is cool too. I use it mostly for black powder loads.

My main problem with bullet casting, lubing, reloading, and even with shooting, is... the older I get the busier I am and I just ain't had time for several years now. My next projects are 8x56R Kropatschek, .45-70, and 5.56mm... if I can ever get to them... I have a book to write that I still ain't got to yet, though, and the clock is ticking...

[BWest]

Clean your molds with mineral spirits and a small brush, then air dry them. Ballistol will remove minor rust, but I have had to remove major rust by immersion in lemon juice... then Ballistol will neutralize any remnants of acid. Lube the parts that need lubing (e.g. alignment pins) with a tiny touch of beeswax after heating them. Beeswax melts and spreads like crazy though, so you have to do that very lightly and very carefully carefully. Though I have commercial products, I do most fluxing of lead with beeswax, too... and its the main ingredient in black powder bullet lube, along with some amount of some kind of VEGETABLE oil.


The lemon juice thing is a good idea.

I usually keep my steel molds coated liberally in motor oil, since its so humid here and they rust fast.

[WinterSoldier]

The lemon juice thing is a good idea.

I usually keep my steel molds coated liberally in motor oil, since its so humid here and they rust fast.

I'll give you a "clue". If exposed to high humidity, the steel pins in aluminum molds will rust. All of my molds are in controlled temperature/humidity except my 5.56mm Lee which I was getting ready to use several years ago but left in a shed, never used. The pins on it were rusted quite significantly when I looked at it a couple of days ago. I use Ballistol on almost everything unless I think it might attack the material. It will prevent and even remove rust and will prevent rust even if mixed with water.

And... BTW: I suspect you will find that your "steel" molds are IRON.

I actually have a preference of brass over aluminum molds in cases were custom mold makers will use either.

[leadpoison]

anyone here loading cast bullets for 6.5 Creedmoor?

[BWest]

I'll give you a "clue". If exposed to high humidity, the steel pins in aluminum molds will rust. All of my molds are in controlled temperature/humidity except my 5.56mm Lee which I was getting ready to use several years ago but left in a shed, never used. The pins on it were rusted quite significantly when I looked at it a couple of days ago. I use Ballistol on almost everything unless I think it might attack the material. It will prevent and even remove rust and will prevent rust even if mixed with water.

And... BTW: I suspect you will find that your "steel" molds are IRON.

I actually have a preference of brass over aluminum molds in cases were custom mold makers will use either.

I've got a bunch of the 55 grain lee cast and coated

Yet to get reliable cycling, but I have gotten pretty close, got some loaded up that I need to experiment some more with soon.

[BWest]

anyone here loading cast bullets for 6.5 Creedmoor?

it can be done, though I think you probably lose a lot of the value of shooting a 6.5 creedmore when you do.

[leadpoison]

it can be done, though I think you probably lose a lot of the value of shooting a 6.5 creedmore when you do.

gotcha. i have the high dollar stuff but am too cheap to plink with that stuff...

[WinterSoldier]

I've got a bunch of the 55 grain lee cast and coated

Yet to get reliable cycling, but I have gotten pretty close, got some loaded up that I need to experiment some more with soon.

There would be some effect from the powder coating vs my Lee allox tumble lube, but what powder are you using?

[BWest]

There would be some effect from the powder coating vs my Lee allox tumble lube, but what powder are you using?My previous best results were with h4895.

I have a bunch of Shooter's World Tactical Rifle, and I've found at least one mention of it working well with the lee 55gr bullet.

Going to test some loads with that this week if I find the time.

Sent from my moto g(7) optimo maxx(XT1955DL) using Tapatalk

[WinterSoldier]

I'm sure I have a reduced load for 155 gr for BCL-2 that I worked up myself from scratch using Richard Lee's formula. HOWEVER, Lee's formula did NOT work. The resulting load made a big bottle-rocket whooshing sound for a second or two with no detonation. Fortunately, the bullet did launch. I ALMOST dropped BCL-2 right then and there, but eventually decided to make one more try with a heavier charge. THAT one worked and I shot a good many rounds with it. If I recall correctly, I used either exactly the same powder charge with 155 gr as well as 125 or 130 gr (whichever it was), or with a very minor adjustment. However since that one is a total wild hair, maybe I shouldn't be giving it out. The other was, I believe, H4198, and I think it was based on a book load but I don't remember the details including even what book (but Modern Reloading is the most likely suspect). I would suggest, however, that you check Lyman's book on cast bullet loads, the most recent edition. At the time I worked up these loads I didn't have it and now that I have it... its probably out of date... and I've never used it. I have a log of every load and every batch of every load I have ever made, but I can't access it right now. I'll get back with you on this when I can access it. It will be a couple of days.

In my Albanian SKS all of my reduced cast bullet loads cut the MOA of my groups by almost half over Russian commercial ammo at 100 yards. I never fired any of it at a target at more than 100 yards..

NOTE: I may not have tried the H4198 load with 155 gr bullets.

[BWest]

I have the latest lyman cast bullet book, it doesn't have much in the way of "loads that will cycle" for gas operated guns like ARs and SKSs

I'm also working up a load for the yugo SKS I bought from you, I have the lee 160 grain mold. I'm trying 2400 based on some forums I've read indicating some rifles will cycle with 2400. I have a ton of it and use it for reduced rifle loads in most milsurp cartridges already.

[WinterSoldier]

I have the latest lyman cast bullet book, it doesn't have much in the way of "loads that will cycle" for gas operated guns like ARs and SKSs

I'm also working up a load for the yugo SKS I bought from you, I have the lee 160 grain mold. I'm trying 2400 based on some forums I've read indicating some rifles will cycle with 2400. I have a ton of it and use it for reduced rifle loads in most milsurp cartridges already.

No real reason for it, but 2400 is a powder that I've never used. Just before the implosion, I was looking for some just to have it, but there was none where I looked (Kevins). I use H4198 about the same way you use 2400.

Both of my loads cycle that Albanian perfectly. I've never tried them in any other SKS.

[BWest]

Besides cast bullets in the 8mm mauser and .303 british, I use 2400 for .30 carbine. 100 grain lee bullets sized to .309 are more accurate than factory/surplus ammo in my m1.

[Cattle/Horses]

BW, You've seen this I guess?

https://hodgdon.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/common-european-cartridges.pdf

AND

https://hodgdon.com/resources/data-sheets/

[WinterSoldier]

I use 4198 for exactly the same, except for the M1 Carbine, but also for Mannlicher and Mosin Nagant, I believe, and possibly others. . I got an M1 Carbine from CMP and also a M1. I sat and looked at them awhile, one at a time, then sold them. They just didn't sing to me. Dad was a medic in the ETO in WWII... but medics were unarmed. The only gun he ever had his hands on was one night only, somewhere in Germany, he got put on guard duty, with a German Commission Rifle. In dad's case, he wasn't a medic because of aptitude or experience... but because he was about blind as a bat. Anyone he might have shot at with that Commission Rifle would probably have been pretty safe. Other folks... hard to say. Dad was drafted under a classification for "Limited Duty", meaning that he wasn't supposed to be sent outside of CONUS. When he heard the unit had orders for Europe, he asked the first shirt about his limited duty classification. The answer was... "Don't worry. We took care of that." It was, after all, a medical unit. Apparently what one doctor did, another doctor could undo. The irony is that first sergeant was a professional NCO who had been busted many times. Apparently HE didn't want to go... so he got himself busted and dad said the last time he saw the guy he was digging "six bys"... a hole 6' x 6' x 6'. You dig the hole, make it nice and tidy and square, then fill that one in and dig another one. Punitive duty... Dad ended up at the end of the war at Leipzig on the Elbe, deep in what became East Germany... where we met the Roosians. He dealt with Russians exchanging prisoners, sent DPs back to their home countries if they had one, etc. Then he was ordered to Japan, but Japan surrendered while he was waiting to board ship at Marseilles, so he just got shipped home.

[WinterSoldier]

BW, You've seen this I guess?

https://hodgdon.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/common-european-cartridges.pdf

AND

https://hodgdon.com/resources/data-sheets/

Not lately, but the powder companies don't usually give load data for lead bullets. Lead bullets, especially for rifles, are their own little nice and specialty... best served by Lee and Lyman.

[Cattle/Horses]

Not lately, but the powder companies don't usually give load data for lead bullets. Lead bullets, especially for rifles, are their own little nice and specialty... best served by Lee and Lyman.

Most of the cowboy action loads are for cast bullets I believe. Haven't looked at that PDF in a while though.

[WinterSoldier]

Most of the cowboy action loads are for cast bullets I believe. Haven't looked at that PDF in a while though.

A cowboy load for a Mannlicher, a Mauser, a Carcano, and Enfield, a Mosin Nagant, a SKS, a Kropatschek...? I DON'T THEENK SO!

I like my cowboy load for a Martini Henry. Fill that huge honking .450/.577 cartridge (THE original BOXER primed round) full of black powder and blast away!!!

[WinterSoldier]

My memory algorithm needs adjustment, but it has been almost 14 years... There was no H4198 load for the SKS. I guess I was thinking of the Mosin Nagant.

These are my notes on load development. I stuck with 25 gr. for future loads. FURTHER, the lube was Lee alox tumble lube and primers CCI military primers (NEVER USE ANYTHING BUT MILITARY PRIMERS IN A SKS!!! SLAM FIRES CAN RESULT AND SLAM FIRES HAVE BEEN DETERMINED IN A COURT OF LAW TO = FULL AUTO... even though they aren't). This is a bootleg load, that worked for me in my Albanian SKS but if you use it you do so AT YOUR OWN RISK.

20071021 0077 7.62x39mm Russian 155 gr. GC LRN sized to .311 25 gr. BL-C (2) 80 Lee pp. 410 & 157 (should produce velocity about 1770 & pressure about 26000 by my calculations) - WS This load gave mild recoil but always cycled the action properly plus it produced extremely good accuracy. My 1st three shots with it at 100 yards were a 10x and two 9s.

20071021 0078 7.62x39mm Russian 155 gr. GC LRN sized to .311 29 gr. BL-C (2) 32 Lee p. 410 This load is TOO HOT. It did NOT produce good accuracy and several shots blew the magazine open.

[WinterSoldier]

Additional notes: I used both wheel weight and linotype lead in various batches and didn't not any difference in performance. I also used the same 25 gr. load with a batch of 125 gr. spire point linotype cast bullets and didn't note any difference in performance.

For any newbie hand loaders out there... this is a cast lead load. NOT to be used with copper jacketed bullets.